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	<title>Comments on: The Trivialization of God</title>
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	<link>http://eternalperspectives.com/2005/06/30/the-trivialization-of-god/</link>
	<description>. . . searching for sanity in a Christian culture gone mad</description>
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		<title>By: Catez</title>
		<link>http://eternalperspectives.com/2005/06/30/the-trivialization-of-god/comment-page-1/#comment-1099</link>
		<dc:creator>Catez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jul 2005 01:02:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The postmodern view is not one I subscribe to. But that isn&#039;t what I picked up from the commenter you responded to. I saw more that he was saying &quot;well I can engage in this discussion even if I&#039;m not formally trained&quot;. I don&#039;t see why he shouldn&#039;t.

You said: &quot;But when a Douglas Moo or Douglas Groothuis makes a statement about their area of expertise, it must - or should - carry more weight than what I say.&quot;

Not necessarily. Sorry Mike but I&#039;ve been burned by the belief that the &quot;most learned men&quot; know best. I won&#039;t bore you with the details of the abusive church I was in. Nothing carries more weight than the Holy Spirit speaking to conscience. And if it isn&#039;t something that is helping me to conform to Christ then it&#039;s just dry intellectualism. 
So it is dependent on that. If what you say  at a given time is the best advice/explanation and one that rings true then I&#039;ll take your opinion over theirs.

I see what you are saying but to be honest it can also lead to elitism - and in so doing the ability for the layperson to hear God and communicate him is subjugated to the &quot;expert&quot;. Everyone can communicate the gospel. Everyone can communicate the power of God working through them. Some of the expertise is very valuable and some is a hindrance.  

Reading your post it also sounded to me like you were saying theological knowledge=godliness. i.e. the more studied one is the more one can communicate for God. 
&quot;For some dumbfounding reason, many Christians seem to think that we are as capable and qualified to speak for God as those who have devoted their lives to the exacting study of the Scriptures and to an understanding of the inspired words of Him who watches us.&quot;

Not everyone is as capable at expounding the scriptures. But not everyone who expounds the scriptures speaks for God either. Communicating for God is a work of the Holy Spirit.
I very much appreciate the work of theologians. However they are not my church authority - unless they also happen to be leaders in my church. 
I respect the foot as much as the eye - in fact the parts we consider the least comely are given greater honour. 
Some people learn by discussion. Why not let them discuss and learn in the process? I don&#039;t believe everyone should shut up because the expert is the only one who knows. I do agree with listening. But again - how does some-one differentiate between the value of Spong or Groothius? They don&#039;t have to be a rocket scientist to see the error. And they don&#039;t have to have studied for years to point it out.

All of that is really just to say that while there is much value in the scholarship - let&#039;s not put down the layperson for their own understanding of God and their own informal study. They may not be highly educated but might leave me for dust in terms of character, serving others and spreading the gospel. I can think of people like that</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The postmodern view is not one I subscribe to. But that isn&#8217;t what I picked up from the commenter you responded to. I saw more that he was saying &#8220;well I can engage in this discussion even if I&#8217;m not formally trained&#8221;. I don&#8217;t see why he shouldn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>You said: &#8220;But when a Douglas Moo or Douglas Groothuis makes a statement about their area of expertise, it must &#8211; or should &#8211; carry more weight than what I say.&#8221;</p>
<p>Not necessarily. Sorry Mike but I&#8217;ve been burned by the belief that the &#8220;most learned men&#8221; know best. I won&#8217;t bore you with the details of the abusive church I was in. Nothing carries more weight than the Holy Spirit speaking to conscience. And if it isn&#8217;t something that is helping me to conform to Christ then it&#8217;s just dry intellectualism.<br />
So it is dependent on that. If what you say  at a given time is the best advice/explanation and one that rings true then I&#8217;ll take your opinion over theirs.</p>
<p>I see what you are saying but to be honest it can also lead to elitism &#8211; and in so doing the ability for the layperson to hear God and communicate him is subjugated to the &#8220;expert&#8221;. Everyone can communicate the gospel. Everyone can communicate the power of God working through them. Some of the expertise is very valuable and some is a hindrance.  </p>
<p>Reading your post it also sounded to me like you were saying theological knowledge=godliness. i.e. the more studied one is the more one can communicate for God.<br />
&#8220;For some dumbfounding reason, many Christians seem to think that we are as capable and qualified to speak for God as those who have devoted their lives to the exacting study of the Scriptures and to an understanding of the inspired words of Him who watches us.&#8221;</p>
<p>Not everyone is as capable at expounding the scriptures. But not everyone who expounds the scriptures speaks for God either. Communicating for God is a work of the Holy Spirit.<br />
I very much appreciate the work of theologians. However they are not my church authority &#8211; unless they also happen to be leaders in my church.<br />
I respect the foot as much as the eye &#8211; in fact the parts we consider the least comely are given greater honour.<br />
Some people learn by discussion. Why not let them discuss and learn in the process? I don&#8217;t believe everyone should shut up because the expert is the only one who knows. I do agree with listening. But again &#8211; how does some-one differentiate between the value of Spong or Groothius? They don&#8217;t have to be a rocket scientist to see the error. And they don&#8217;t have to have studied for years to point it out.</p>
<p>All of that is really just to say that while there is much value in the scholarship &#8211; let&#8217;s not put down the layperson for their own understanding of God and their own informal study. They may not be highly educated but might leave me for dust in terms of character, serving others and spreading the gospel. I can think of people like that</p>
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		<title>By: Catez</title>
		<link>http://eternalperspectives.com/2005/06/30/the-trivialization-of-god/comment-page-1/#comment-1098</link>
		<dc:creator>Catez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 18:24:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Let me put it another way - I don&#039;t need a scholar to show me how to wash feet. But he/she can help me on predestination. Maybe... as I mentioned, some definitely can&#039;t since they deny central truths that even a babe in Christ knows by faith.

&lt;em&gt;Catez:

I don&#039;t think I disagree much with what you - or some others - have said here.  What I&#039;m really arguing against is the postmodern (if that&#039;s what it is) idea that one person&#039;s opinion is just as valuable and authoritative as another&#039;s.  I don&#039;t buy that.  I certainly agree that any doctrinally sound believer has more to &lt;strike&gt;say&lt;/strike&gt; contribute than Bishop SpongBob.  But when a Douglas Moo or Douglas Groothuis makes a statement about their area of expertise, it must - or should - carry more weight than what I say.  Don&#039;t you think so?&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let me put it another way &#8211; I don&#8217;t need a scholar to show me how to wash feet. But he/she can help me on predestination. Maybe&#8230; as I mentioned, some definitely can&#8217;t since they deny central truths that even a babe in Christ knows by faith.</p>
<p><em>Catez:</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think I disagree much with what you &#8211; or some others &#8211; have said here.  What I&#8217;m really arguing against is the postmodern (if that&#8217;s what it is) idea that one person&#8217;s opinion is just as valuable and authoritative as another&#8217;s.  I don&#8217;t buy that.  I certainly agree that any doctrinally sound believer has more to <strike>say</strike> contribute than Bishop SpongBob.  But when a Douglas Moo or Douglas Groothuis makes a statement about their area of expertise, it must &#8211; or should &#8211; carry more weight than what I say.  Don&#8217;t you think so?</em></p>
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		<title>By: Catez</title>
		<link>http://eternalperspectives.com/2005/06/30/the-trivialization-of-god/comment-page-1/#comment-1097</link>
		<dc:creator>Catez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 18:13:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eternalperspectives.com/?p=198#comment-1097</guid>
		<description>&quot;For some dumbfounding reason, many Christians seem to think that we are as capable and qualified to speak for God as those who have devoted their lives to the exacting study of the Scriptures and to an understanding of the inspired words of Him who watches us.&quot;

I think I can speak better than Bishop Spong. Or the theologian whose post I read the other day proposing that God approves of abortion and the bible supports it. 

Frankly Mike, I appreciate theologians. I also appreciate the non-theologians who roll up their sleeves and set the example by serving. They speak volumes for God.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;For some dumbfounding reason, many Christians seem to think that we are as capable and qualified to speak for God as those who have devoted their lives to the exacting study of the Scriptures and to an understanding of the inspired words of Him who watches us.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think I can speak better than Bishop Spong. Or the theologian whose post I read the other day proposing that God approves of abortion and the bible supports it. </p>
<p>Frankly Mike, I appreciate theologians. I also appreciate the non-theologians who roll up their sleeves and set the example by serving. They speak volumes for God.</p>
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